Talk:Hong Kong Democratic Party stirs up universal suffrage reform package controversy

To the reviewer, if any of the names look familiar to you, most of the names mentioned in four of my previous articles have been mentioned here, with the exception of Lee Cheuk-yan and a couple of non-radical politicians. :) Kayau (talk &middot; contribs) 06:59, 22 June 2010 (UTC)

Review of revision 1048441 [Failed]
Hi, actually 3 sources are in English. Kayau (talk &middot; contribs) 10:52, 22 June 2010 (UTC)
 * Three sources out of seventeen. That's 3/17 of the article's information. Can none of the Chinese sources be cut? Δεν δοδγε  τ\c 13:11, 22 June 2010 (UTC)
 * I've cut one, but the rest have to stay... unless the article is shortened too, which is something I don't want. Alternatively, someone could persuade User:KTo288 to review. I hope you reviewers will be more considerate and use google translate, thanks. Because tomorrow the council will meet and this will become old news! Kayau (talk &middot; contribs) 14:15, 22 June 2010 (UTC)
 * It has nothing to do with being considerate, I'm afraid. Google translate is not reliable enough. --Brian McNeil / talk 00:37, 23 June 2010 (UTC)
 * Hmm, actually in the past people have relied on Google Translate quite heavily, especially for some of my Russian-sourced articles. As I recall, ZH -> EN translation is pretty decent due to the simplicity of Chinese grammar. Tempodivalse [talk]  00:40, 23 June 2010 (UTC)
 * *Is the case different here? On the previous articles, the reviewer used Google translate to review them. Kayau (talk &middot; contribs) 00:41, 23 June 2010 (UTC)
 * "Google Translate only helps where a reviewer is well-versed in the target language (English), and above 'tourist' in the source language." = I'd have to disagree with that. A lot of people who reviewed my Russian-sourced articles (or Kayau's other Hong Kong articles for that matter) don't have any knowledge of the source language, and there were no objections. Tempodivalse [talk]  00:45, 23 June 2010 (UTC)
 * A lot of people don't do proper reviews, either. I dislike rubber stamp reviews. A review is suppose to do a full copyedit, copycheck, and factcheck. You can do a basic factcheck with google translate, but a copycheck is almost impossible without at least *a little* knowledge of the source language. That's why I'll review Spanish articles, but I try and stay away from Chinese ones. I know just enough about Spanish to be able to do a copycheck of the article. Gopher65talk 00:50, 23 June 2010 (UTC)
 * Are you sure? Please use google traslate to translate the fifth source. The headline already says that 'Andrew' and 'Martin' are thinking of leaving. As there's only one Andrew and one Martin in the article, you can be quite sure that it's them. Kayau (talk &middot; contribs) 00:55, 23 June 2010 (UTC)

Apart from the reliability of Google Translate, I am also unable to find other sources. The only two notable English papers in Hong Kong are The Standard and the South China Morning Post. The latter requires subscription, while the former is free so it doesn't provide as much info as the SCMP, and I've 'used up' their articles as refs. BTW 'has been stirring' is a present perfect continuous as far as I know... Kayau (talk &middot; contribs) 00:58, 23 June 2010 (UTC)
 * Agree, it's not Passive voice at all. That would be "has been stirred (the subject does not do the action itself). Present perfect continuous should be perfectly acceptable for us. IIRC, the BBC uses this not infrequently. Tempodivalse [talk]  01:14, 23 June 2010 (UTC)

Translations of extracts of the sources
I'll work on the translations here... ✅, feel free to ask for translations of more extracts in case I missed out any. Kayau (talk &middot; contribs) 02:51, 23 June 2010 (UTC)
 * Title translation: Elsie Leung says Democratic Party's District Council Method is Worth Consideration (title says it all)
 * Democratic Party elder Szeto Wah was present at the Alliance for Universal Suffrage meeting yesterday. He supports the Party's District Council method: 'Criticising the Democratic Party is betraying the Hong Kong people, and defamatory... Democratic Party lawmaker Cheung Man-kwong criticised some of those who opposed the method, and said that they should let people have the liberty of expressing themselves: 'using loudspeakers, foul language and threats to stop people from speaking is oppression not democracy... Democratic Party vice-chairperson Emily Lau said, Wong Yuk-man's (an LSD guy) saying that the democratic party and the central government doing a 'under-table trade' (OK, that's VERY literal but I don't know how to translate that) was incorrect, and was simply a conspiracy theory and condemned Wong for discrediting their party and insulting their members.
 * 80-year-old Chan suddenly yelled that he was betrayed by the Democratic Party during yesterday's meeting. 'Since the formation of the Democratic Party, I've supported them, but now they are supporting a proposal that has no promise at all... On the other side, a 31-year-old man named Cheung, who was wearing a shirt with the words 'fix the rotten proposal' printed on and waving a leaflet called 'the 2012 constitutional package is all wrong', said that he was not an LSD member and even voted for Emily Lau in 2008... but the craziest one must have been a middle-aged lady. She arrived at the venue at about 3 o'clock, and  since then she'd kept shouting that the party has betrayed the Hong Kong people, and often rushed towards Democratic Party members to berate them...
 * But just as Ho stared to speak, he was booed and people shouted 'The Democratic Party is shameless! Albert ho has betrayed us!' At last, the head of the 廣播處 (whatever that is), Franklin Wong, had to go and pick him up with his car. However, when Wong's car drove out of the park, some 'Brothers of Victoria Park' still ran after him, and nearly 20 police officers had to protect him so that he could leave.
 * Democratic Party votes yes with high support rate -- District Council method should pass -- Andrew Cheng may leave party as a result -- Martin Lee says he'll think it over for two weeks (Title says it all)
 * If [Martin] Lee and [Andrew] Cheng leave, about 20 others are expected to follow them
 * }
 * Central Government's Cooperation prevents political situation's 'radicalisation' from getting too serious -- helps the next chief to 'dissect the bullet' (whatever that means, but I didn't say that in the article!) -- Studies say that Xi's decision gains himself reputation (title says it all)
 * During the half-hour news conference, Chief Executive Donald Tsang had seven times praised the Democratic Party for their sincerity and responsiility.
 * Tsang Hin-chi says District Council method is approved by central government (title)
 * Former National People's Congress member Tsang hin-chi said, the one-person-two-votes method, which had been accepted by the SAR government, was also approved by the central government and adhered to the Basic Law. It is one big step Hong Kong's political system, etc etc.
 * Albert Ho tries to get [Andrew] Cheng's and [James] To's support in private (title says it all)
 * Several LSD members and citizens went to the Causeway Bay branch of the Professional Teachers' Union yesterday, where the Democratic Party's meeting was held. They demanded that the Democrats should not back the proposal. When Albert ho left, they cried insults at him, and the police had to protect him so that he could get in the car and leave.
 * The Democratic Party called for a meeting. After 5 hours of discussion, they decided to back the proposal. The legislative council proposal was supported by 246 people and opposed by 63; the chief executive proposal was backed by 237 and opposed by 71l...
 * Mrs [Rita] Fan pledges opposition parties to respect the mainstream public opinion (title says it all)
 * Civic Party insists on opposing the reform package (title says it all)
 * Under the reform proposal, there will be ten new seats in the legislative council, five of which are geographical constituencies and the rest functional constituencies. The latter are all given to the District Council, so this proposal is called the District Council Proposal.
 * Former National People's Congress member Tsang hin-chi said, the one-person-two-votes method, which had been accepted by the SAR government, was also approved by the central government and adhered to the Basic Law. It is one big step Hong Kong's political system, etc etc.
 * Albert Ho tries to get [Andrew] Cheng's and [James] To's support in private (title says it all)
 * Several LSD members and citizens went to the Causeway Bay branch of the Professional Teachers' Union yesterday, where the Democratic Party's meeting was held. They demanded that the Democrats should not back the proposal. When Albert ho left, they cried insults at him, and the police had to protect him so that he could get in the car and leave.
 * The Democratic Party called for a meeting. After 5 hours of discussion, they decided to back the proposal. The legislative council proposal was supported by 246 people and opposed by 63; the chief executive proposal was backed by 237 and opposed by 71l...
 * Mrs [Rita] Fan pledges opposition parties to respect the mainstream public opinion (title says it all)
 * Civic Party insists on opposing the reform package (title says it all)
 * Under the reform proposal, there will be ten new seats in the legislative council, five of which are geographical constituencies and the rest functional constituencies. The latter are all given to the District Council, so this proposal is called the District Council Proposal.
 * Mrs [Rita] Fan pledges opposition parties to respect the mainstream public opinion (title says it all)
 * Civic Party insists on opposing the reform package (title says it all)
 * Under the reform proposal, there will be ten new seats in the legislative council, five of which are geographical constituencies and the rest functional constituencies. The latter are all given to the District Council, so this proposal is called the District Council Proposal.
 * Civic Party insists on opposing the reform package (title says it all)
 * Under the reform proposal, there will be ten new seats in the legislative council, five of which are geographical constituencies and the rest functional constituencies. The latter are all given to the District Council, so this proposal is called the District Council Proposal.
 * Under the reform proposal, there will be ten new seats in the legislative council, five of which are geographical constituencies and the rest functional constituencies. The latter are all given to the District Council, so this proposal is called the District Council Proposal.

'''COULD SOMEONE PRETTY PLEASE REVIEW THIS? THE LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL MEETING IS TO BE HELD SOON! PLEASE!''' Kayau (talk &middot; contribs) 03:07, 23 June 2010 (UTC)

I don't mean to be rude, but the meeting is BEING HELD RIGHT NOW and results will be coming soon. Also, Andrew has already announced that he's leaving... Kayau (talk &middot; contribs) 12:30, 23 June 2010 (UTC)

PLEASE! I can assure you this is much more important than Stanley McChrystal... :) (OK, it's not more important but it's certainly more urgent!) Kayau (talk &middot; contribs) 14:54, 23 June 2010 (UTC)
 * I'll see what I can do... C628 (talk) 14:59, 23 June 2010 (UTC)


 * Hi, I saw your removal on the article. Actually what the ref was talking about was focusing on the Democrats' amendments, not the whole thing, so only the five new functional constituencies were shown. I will add an extra ref for that (though I can't promise that it will be in Eng...) Kayau (talk &middot; contribs) 15:14, 23 June 2010 (UTC)