Talk:One in five Americans finds socialism superior, poll says

Original reporting
Both of the below have been forwarded to scoop in full.

Gabriel McClosky-Ross
Personal statement from Gabriel McClosky-Ross, executive director of the Social Democrats, USA (personal details & unrelated info exempt). Mr McClosky-Ross emphasizes that this is not an official party position:

"Below is my personal statement as executive director.

I joined the Socialist Party, USA in 1972, when I was 16. That was seven months before the name change to Social Democrats, USA. I was a subscriber to the Party's publication, New America for four years by that point. I grew up in a Catholic working class neighborhood. Many of my neighbors read the Catholic Worker. However, I would not meet another self described social democrat or democratic socialist who was close to my age until I completed college and entered the seminary when I was 21. That was not for a lack of my attempts at persuasion. Now when I speak on behalf of the Social Democrats, I meet many people who call themselves socialists or they are considering doing so.

Two things have changed. First, Stalinism in the Soviet Union finally and thankfully collapsed and The Peoples' Republic of China is a transparently "state capitalist" regime. Second, the propaganda machine that equated private ownership of productive property with democracy is spurting under onslaught of facts that indicate just the opposite. There were two presidential elections in a row were the count look fishy and the money trail lead to the top of Republican Party. Then the banks collapsed and it was apparent that the largest financial institutions in the world were involved in sub-prime mortgage ponzi schemes.

I am not sure whether to celebrate or lament becoming an economist and union organizer instead of a priest given the current crisis. As my mentor, Michael Harrington, was fond of saying there are many kinds of socialism. Stalin, Hitler, and Mao, history's three greatest mass murderers, all called themselves socialists. Hopefully, America is ready for a broad social democratic movement that works with trade unions and community organizations for national health care, re-industrialization, ecologically friendly mass transit, infrastructure repair, and eventually a democratization of our economy. Building such a movement will be very hard work. The cyber-world has many benefits, but people seemed to be convinced that social change can occur by email. It is great shame, that it takes 8.2% unemployment and massive economic dislocation to push people back to real time organizing and protest.

Simply that people are angry is not enough. The Bolsheviks, Fascists, and Nazis all road waves of mass discontent to power. A peoples' movement must be militantly democratic and refuse to make common cause with even the 'mildest and friendliest totalitarians.' A truly democratic movement for social democracy must transcend the narrow special interest group politics that has made up most of political discourse since the protests against the Vietnam War. To transcend the current economic crisis we need a full employment economy and that means a movement concentrated on 'red letter' social democratic issues of democratic worker and community control of industry."

John Birch Society
Statement from John McManus, President, The John Birch Society:

"If 20 percent of the American people prefer socialism, it is likely that half believe it has more to do with sociability that it has to do with an economic system that places government in control of their lives. Ask these 20 percent what socialism truly is and the response will rarely point to the great hero of all socialists, Karl Marx

The John Birch Society believes that everyone is a capitalist. If one starts out defining capital as the means of production (which is its definition), then everyone - from the primitive fisherman to the corporate executive - uses capital and is a capitalist.

The distinction that most don't make is who owns and controls the capital. Does each individual have the right to own his means of production - even a fishing pole? Or does the government own and/or control all the means of production.

When each individual has the right to own capital (property), there is freedom - up to the point where no one is permitted to impede someone else's similar right. Where socialism reigns, the government dominates, either completely a la communism or essentially a la fascism (Nazi-style or Mussolini-style).

Most Americans are victims of an absolutely horrible educational system. Too many have been persuaded that government should take care of them. We tell such fools that, if that's what they want, they should turn themselves in at the local prison where they will be cared for 24 hours a day. We ask them to stop advocating converting our entre nation into what effectively will be a coast-to-coast prison.

The proper role of government can never be more than the protection of the lives, liberty and property of the people who pay for it. The improper role of government is to take care of the people - which it always does poorly and does so almost always as a grab for power rather than a supposedly noble concern for the downtrodden."

Minor tyle tweak needed
Since I can't edit archived pages, could somebody please change the lead sentence to say "Twenty percent" instead of 20% - numbers should always be spelled out when leading a sentence. Thanks. Mindmatrix (talk) 16:05, 21 April 2009 (UTC)


 * ✅ In the future, you can use editprotected when requesting a change to a protected page. tempo divalse  16:07, 21 April 2009 (UTC)


 * Thanks. I'll make sure to use that template when the need arises. Mindmatrix (talk) 16:44, 21 April 2009 (UTC)